Francoeur trade reaction

After posting that original blog entry with tonight’s lineup, I went to the dugout to talk to Bobby Cox, who quickly explained the Tommy Hanson situation and then got the call from Frank Wren. 

Moments later, Cox grabbed Chino Cadahia and both immediately headed toward the clubhouse to inform Jeff Francoeur that he’d been traded.  

Just like that, Francoeur went from being one of the most scrutinized players on this blog to being a member of the Mets outfield. 

To recap the trade, the Braves sent Francoeur and cash considerations to the Mets in exchange for Ryan Church.  The specifics of the cash consideration weren’t revealed.  But it was probably something in the neighborhood of $250,000  —  which would account for the differences in their salaries.

I’ve got to add to the main story on the site.  But in short, I think this is a trade that has the potential to benefit both players. 

Church seemed to fall out of favor with the Mets and while Francoeur was one of the most likable players in the Braves clubhouse, his performance had put him in a position where he was likely going to be non-tendered if he remained in Atlanta until the conclusion of this season.

I would have to say that Jeff Francoeur was one of the better human beings that I’ve ever come across in this business.  Obviously, there have been times that he’s been furious with things that I’ve written and consequently chosen to give me the silent treatment for a while. 

But over the past six weeks, I saw the 25-year-old outfielder truly mature and accept the fact that baseball is a tough business.  I wish him nothing but the best and when the Mets visit Turner Field next week, I hope the fans show him how much they appreciated the dedication and determination he displayed throughout his 4 1/2 seasons in Atlanta.

There was certainly reason to criticize his game.  But in the midst of all of his struggles, Francoeur never lost his desire to give everything he had every day that he came to work. 

Tonight’s New Lineup
Nate McLouth 8
Martin Prado 3
Chipper Jones 5
Brian McCann 2
Garret Anderson 7
Matt Diaz 9
Brooks Conrad 4
Diory Hernandez 6
Derek Lowe 1

139 Comments

Matt Diaz should be ******* SCREAMING for a trade or something. I like baseball more than football because players don’t do that, but players SHOULD do that if someone who is CLEARLY not as good or as hot(streak wise… that sounds weird)… as them is playing ahead of them. GAH!

I can’t wait for this book to come out: http://www.mcfarlandpub.com/book-2.php?id=978-0-7864-3920-1

Is this true….Ryan Church for Jeff Francoeur?!

It is true. Franceour has been traded for Ryan Church.

I like the move and am surprised that the Mets would make it. Marc – whats the deal!!

Yes it is true, they are discussing it on MLB Network now

WHOA!!! Frenchy to NY??????????????

What?? Ryan Church?? Why in the hell would they make a deal with the Mets?? Man this is so lame.

honestly here come the braves

please please please be true

Why is it lame Viva?

Yeah, they just said on ESPN that the Braves will be allowed to keep the turkey underwear. This makes the trade worthwhile. At first I was a bit concerned that we were trading the second worst offensive outfielder for the worst offensive outfielder. The underwear tip the scales (no pun intended)

This year Church is hitting .326/.359/.444 in ballparks not named Citi Field.

Why is it lame? Because Ryan Church isn’t the answer to anything. He’s not much better than Frenchy and he is injury prone. He is also ANOTHER left handed bat who can’t hit lefties whatsoever. Also, I hate making deals with rivals in our own division.

You dont like a deal where we send the worst OF hitter in baseball for the past two years to our rivals? that just hurts them, not like we are sending them chipper

PW.. so he’s hitting better in hitter friendly parks. Too bad we don’t have one of those.

Yes, the Braves have confirmed the trade…Francoeur and cash considerations to Mets in exchange for Ryan Church…also the Braves have optioned Hanson back to Gwinnett and brought Valdez up to provide some bullpen depth this weekend…Hanson would be eligible to come back to start against the Giants on July 20.

He has higher average, higher obp, higher slugging %. Basially, I am not saying its perfect, but its an improvement. Its not like church can do any worse

this is great church has some value braves r wheeling and dealing more moves is a coming

So basically the Braves received $575,000 to cut Francoeur?

Bullpen depth? We use the same 3 guys every game!

Also, with all the injuries to the Mets, why the hell would they want to (slightly) downgrade their offense? Maybe to get someone who won’t get hurt?

longball.. re-read. we paid the mets.

That is the difference between their salaries and I’m hoping Church doesn’t play at all.

Look, if you’re operating under the assumption that Francoeur wasn’t the answer for the Braves in RF, then you have to feel okay about the trade. What could the Braves have gotten for Francoeur? At least they got something. Also, I’m not sure the Braves are now operating under a new assumption that Ryan Church is the answer in the OF. Rather it’s a fresh parting of ways for both parties, Francoeur and the Braves.

Really makes no sence, this is the most neutral trade in history. Hate to see Frenchy turn it on and kick the Braves out of contension.

It cant fail. He cant do worse, its impossible

I like the trade. Even if JF does great in NY, it does not mean he would have done the same in Atlanta. He just needed a fresh start. Good luck JF and thanks for always given maximum effort and contributing to the 05 division title.

GO BRAVES!!!

Udflyer you said cash considerations so we are paying them to take Francoeur what happened to us having no financial flexiblilty.

We are collecting quite the collection of .270-.280, 10-15 homerun per year lefty hitters. I agree though, can’t really be upset about the deal…..just strange…

He’s good defensively. Or gets a good rap. I’ve never looked up his stats. Everyone’s saying “not another LH bat”. The Braves have hit .275/.342/.405 vs LHP but only .242/.327/.392 vs RHP this year. I like the move. Though it makes us crazy LOOGY-vulnerable.

I think the way to look at it is, the Braves aren’t paying more now that they traded Francoeur…rather, they are paying the same as they would’ve had Francoeur stayed with them. He made more…They’re essentially paying the difference. I could be wrong.

Vivabeta…. huh?

If I were Chipper I wouldn’t let it use it because when that song comes up only Chipper should be coming up

This is what I’m saying.. I never like trading with your own division because it could easily come back to bite you in the ***. What if being away from Pendleton really helps Frenchy and he returns to his 07 form? Then it turns out badly.
And I’m sure NO ONE is assuming Church is the answer in RF. I can only think this trade makes sense if the Braves are going to package a deal with Church and a pitcher/prospect for a better player.

thast y we ask mark what is next for the braves

Two other thoughts,

1, Whats his glove like?

2 (and more importantly), on wikipedia it says his batting song is crazy train by ozzy ozbourne. People with that song usually hit ok at turner field

I have a feeling it is just another piece to another deal.

575k is not that much at all in terms of “financial flexibility” in major league baseball.

But ya, maybe we are going to trade him on to a team we are trying to work with, but whom wouldnt touch frenchy

True, zidane. I guess Bobby didn’t know this was coming if Jeff was in the lineup. I wonder if Ryan will be available for the tonights game.

I just think it’s insane to have ANOTHER lefty in the lineup. Or maybe he’s going to the bench and Diaz starts in right.. but COME ON.. TRADING WITH THE METS??? Wren and Scheurholtz should be charged with violating the Trading With The Enemy Act.

Hey mark are you sure we gave money?

http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/mets/2009/07/mets-trade-church-to-braves-la.html

This says that the mets gave us cash.

I say we got the better end of the stick as of now because think about it if it happened the other way around I would be pulling out my hair.

Another thought. I don’t feel there is anything wrong with trading within your division. If you feel like it’s going to make your team better, then why not? Who cares if it also makes the other team better. In this case, you’re in the minority if you felt like Francoeur was going to work it out here in Atlanta. It was time to move on. I’m just glad they were able to get something in return for him. I think we’ll see Diaz starting now with Church and Anderson platooning. How is that not an improvement. If Francoeur does get on track then more power to him. I’ll be happy for him. But something tells me NY isn’t the best place for a struggling player to turn things around. If he plays the same there, do you think the NY fans and media will be as patient and forgiving as they’ve been here? I don’t.

Ryan Church is a really good defensive outfielder. He’s been playing CF recently and I have felt more than comfortable with him there.

Be good to him guys. I’m really going to miss him.

The TWEA is a federal law so that US companies don’t trade with someone we are at war with. It was a joke, Bobbincox.

I agree, there’s no reason to avoid trading in your division in most circumstances. I mean, if I was the Blue Jays, I might not want to deal Roy Halladays to the Yankees or Red Sox, but that is the exception rather than the rule. Someone correct me if I’m wrong, but the Braves had already tried to do a Jeff Francoeur for Cody Ross (Marlins) deal that was turned down. If the N.L. East was where they could get value (or anything) for Francoeur, I have no issue with them going that route.

Viva, Scheurholtz has traded within the division in the past. Millwood comes to mind. I think the Trading With the Enemy Act sounds pretty lame.

Please somone tell me that frenchy wasnt trade for Ryan Church ,, I just read the “latest news” on my fantasy team home page … and I just can believe it, I checked the braves website and it doesnt show any info bout it….: |

Church and KJ for Juan Pierre.

Just kidding, LOL.

According to MLBtraderumors, Braves get cash! Now it swings in favor of the Braves!

Its a good deal. We moved frenchy, and got a decent mlb caliber player in return. Thats alot more than we could of hoped for. I dont understand why the mets made this trade. I honestly thought we wouldn’t be able to give frenchy away, lets alone get a guy to hit .280 back, with good D

A joke, just like the play on my name. I understand. What I don’t understand is being upset that the Braves traded arguably the worst hitting OF in all of baseball to a division rival.

We got cash too??? Wow

If we had to trade the worst hitting OF of all of baseball it makes sense to trade him to your division rival. He will now kills rallys for them, as he once did for us. Thus helping us int he standings

Jurrjens, even better!

This opens up RF for another move? I think Church will be staying. I think we will be bringing in another outfielder bat. We shall see.

I’m just saying there’s something wrong with Frenchy and I honestly think that he will rebound from it. I would bet a thousand dollars that if he was in Texas with Andruw he wouldn’t be putting up the numbers he has this year.

That might be, but that turnaround wasn’t going to happen here in ATL. Let’s face it. It’s been a long time since he’s shown us even a glimpse of hope. I wish him the best. But the right move was to move him…anywhere.

Well, I will be severely bummed if his turnaround happens in New York. Or maybe since I live 30 minutes from Citi Field, I’ll just become a Mets fan if that happens.

This is gonna go down as one of the worst trades in history. Jeff is going to get a real batting coach get straightened out and come back to haunt the Braves again and again. Frank Wren has the IQ of a lump of peat moss. He has caved to media and fan pressure which made no sense. Mark my words

Ok, I really don’t see why all of you are upset. I was a Frenchy fan like many of you, but it was simple, he wanted to leave Atlanta. I know he didn’t come right out and say it but it did want to leave. I wish Jeff the best and if he turns it around, good for him, but Atlanta pitchers should know where to go to get him out, who knows him better right? Church isn’t a savior and maybe he will be moved for another piece, I don’t know, but he is a BALL PLAYER. He plays hard and hussells at all times. I’m ok with getting him. I would rather it been an impact bat, but I don’t think Wren is done. We can still pull this through. Have faith in your team folks!!!!

Yeah, maybe he’ll get a hitting coach who can keep him from swinging at offspeed pitches low and away and in the dirt. Or a hitting coach to teach him how swinging at 50% of 1st pitches isn’t exactly being selective. I mean, who cares about waiting for your pitch when you could just put the first one in play, right? I mean if OBP was so important, why isn’t it on the scoreboard?

We didn’t get cash, we gave up cash. Vivabeta, huh???

awkward move by Wren, frenchy is a very good OF, plus people love him, I dont see any improvement in this deal…,

Oh Braves fans, history speaks for itself. Most players that leave Atlanta for a division rival blow for their new team… Glavine with the Mets and Millwood for the Phillies…. remain positive folks.

Apparently Church is going to make tonights game. Pretty cool. Its really like a 3 hour flight, without the time change. So he could leave at 7:00 ET and be there at 7:00 MT.

This move is really going to test the metal of one Jeff Francoure. He is being given a chance to resurrect his career. But, he is going to have to play well in a hurry, and under the scrutiny of the vicious New York media. It is a tough call to say which way Frenchy will go. It would seem as though the odds are against him. Time will tell.

All real Braves fans wish Jeff the very best. We will be watching with great interest and curiousity. Jeff, we hardly knew ye.

PW, I guess I read it wrong? “The Braves have confirmed that they’ve completed a deal that sends Francoeur AND cash considerations to the Mets in exchange for outfielder Ryan Church.”

Well, I guess now that Prado is the starting second baseman, the lefty/righty dynamic is the same as it was at the beginning of the season, except that KJ could only hit lefties for some reason. I still wish Jeff went to a less stressful and scrutinizing market to get his game back.

Church should also be a better situational hitter–a cagey guy who has good at bats late in the game with runners on base.

I was saying huh? to this comment:

PW.. so he’s hitting better in hitter friendly parks. Too bad we don’t have one of those.

I don’t get it..

Is Church actually suppose to be available for the game?

Ryan Church is just another anchor around the neck of a team that can barely tread water right nowoffensively. Again we trade for an outfielder with no power, limited defensive potential, no speed and an mediocre average. Seems familiar to me…… Hmmmmmm. Pretty soon we will have a team full of mediocre hitters we are just lucky that Prado has been as productive given the way we have used him. Let him go into a slump and TP will ruin his swing too, then where are we?

He doesn’t have limited defensive potential. He’s an above-average defender in Right.

Bravesforever16, The Mets annoucers said he left from Lagrardia (??) to Denver. Huh, I don’t know if that means he’ll play today. But he definitely will tomorrow (Right?). And to everyone, sorry about the cash thing. @ 5:48 was when It was said. But it was cleared up. Here was the link btw: http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2009/07/mets-trade-ryan-church.html

Haha, Pete, That links hilarious. “FRANK! GO TO YOUR ROOM!” Instantly classic.

Yeah, that article really supports the trade. You get a guy who obviously plays worse defense, hits for less power, drives in fewer runs. Even for you stat boys this trade doesn’t make sense.

Ryan church doesn’t have a cannon but he plays gritty like McLouth. According to UZR, there’s little difference between them and Church might actually be better. Ryan is frequently injured because he works with arguably the worst medical staff in MLB. He is also hitting over .300 in every park except for Turner Field (He faced Atl pitching), Citizens bank, Great American, and Busch.

I was saying huh? to this comment:
PW.. so he’s hitting better in hitter friendly parks. Too bad we don’t have one of those.
I don’t get it.. By PWHjort on July 10, 2009 8:27 PM ….
PW I think you were saying that he hits over .300 outside of Citi Field, which is a pitcher’s park. And so is Turner Field.

Gritty= Not very good? McLouth’s defense is really suspect. He can’t throw. Baserunners know this and will take the extra base on him all the time. Church averages about 3.5 outfield assists if he were to play a full schedule. Francouer averages about 13 even though most runners don’t even challenge him any more.

I haven’t watched McLouth all that much, but I’m pretty sure the people handing out the Gold Gloves aren’t complete idiots. He must have done something to deserve it, and I’m sure he didn’t trick anyone into giving him the award, especially in Pittsburgh of all places.

All I can say is that he doesn’t get a great jump, doesn’t take great angles to the ball and can’t throw anybody out. I don’t know what happened in Pittsburgh but I have scrutinized every game he has played in ATL. Not impressed.

Oh and Pittsburgh wouldn’t have anything to do with whether he received the award. It is voted on by Managers and Coaches.

billreef… have you ever written anything positive about the Braves on this blog?

Vivabeta,
Turner field is neutral. And Citi Field isn’t just a pitchers’ park. It’s the park that favors the pitcher more than any other park in MLB outside of MAYBE Petco.

Yes, I speak because I love. I just disagree with the direction the team has taken of late. Bobby isn’t really inspiring, although I have loved him forever. I think he has lost more than a step. I don’t think FW has a clue and I know TP is a nightmare. I have always supported players who hustle and play hard even if they are playing above their ability. I Know what makes up team chemistry and right now I think this team doesn’t know what it is trying to do. I think that all the people that blamed Jeff Francouer for all the teams problems are gonna get pretty quiet now.
This team is gonna have to change management to succeed. It’s really clear that all the moves they have made haven’t really improved the team. They are all knee jerk reactions as opposed to clearly thought out direction. I lived through all those last place teams. I don’t want to go back to that.

ah ok. i was under the impression that it was.
Is Church at the game yet? He should see up close and personal how Atlanta Braves games go down. 2-0 going into the bottom of the 6th. If Colorado gets 3 runs, it’s their game.

On a non-Francoeur note…..Lowe’s looked much better tonight, and much like every other time out that Lowe’s doing well, the rain is falling.

Hopefully the game will just rain out so we can get the win.

Amen to viva. Is Church good as McLouth? Hard to believe. Does he have some pop in his bat like Nate too? I hope he can contribute more than Frechy. Have fun getting crushed by the press Frechy. No really, have fun at NY

PWH:
Do you have a good link for the park factor influence of Citi Field? All I’ve found for the 2009 season to work off of is ESPN.com, but I figure you might have a better source. Thanks.

I wonder if this is gonna effect Bmac in anyways…. lets hope not. I’m pretty sure its crushing to him that his best friend isn’t with him anymore.

There aren’t any park effects yet. Not enough data. There hasn’t been enough baseball played there and by the Mets teams elsewhere to compile the appropriate park effects. Though at this rate it will rate as the most pitcher-friendly ballpark in the league. At least it’s not a complete joke like Coors Light Field.

Yeah, that’s what I’d been thinking (regarding data). Typically the various sources like to use multi-year averages to get a more complete picture, but didn’t know if you had anything more interesting on the early returns. Thanks.

I wish Jeff the best and will be pulling for him in NY while pulling against the Mets. He’s a great guy and he never gave up. I am sorry it didn’t work out, but I will not pass judgement on this move until some time passes and we see the fruit, or lack there of, from the trade. I am of the minority that I don’t think Frenchy was our biggest liability this year and it meant somuch to the team and city to see him succeed. It would have been a great story. Hopefully there’s more left to his story. True Braves fans will pull for him.

I’ve been surprised by several reactions to this trade. How can people be upset by it? What did you expect to get in return for Francoeur? Pujols? We were going to non-tender him in the offseason anyway. People upset about Church manning our outfield? It absolutely cannot get any worse than what we experienced for the last 2 years from Francoeur. At least, this way, we get something in return. And there’s not a single analyst who thinks the Mets got the better end of this deal. It was a trade born out of frustrations from both sides. The Mets manager Manuel was frustrated with Church and the Braves were frustrated with Francoeur. Both have similar salaries and both play the outfield. Fresh starts for all parties involved. It made sense for the Braves and I’m elated that somebody, anybody, different will be in RF.

Rain Rain Rain Rain. Lets hope game is rained out

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, they are back :(

good post by bobby cox’s son there. I agree with it all.

SWEET JESUS MARK BOWMAN!! You’re two for two! Your next post better including the phrase, “What the heck is Bobby thinking, I can’t believe he’s benching Yunel in place of Diory!” This is era of “The curse of Mark Bowman.”

Jurrjens you do realize Esco is hurt right now right?

The best part about Church is… He knows all the mets signs

Okay, 1 of my predictions came true. Frechy Traded or Sent to minors. Next is a not Big but a guys with a pop in his bat acq.(Ryan Church) Now my final 2. KJ get called up before July 31st or traded. 3. Us being tied with the Phils for first by July 31.

I dont think we should trade kelly yet, would be silly. He is alot better than what his trade value is at the moment i think

In a moment of self-publicity I will say that I’ve posted a “mid-season report card”…..feel free to tell me why I’m an idiot. http://tomatalk.mlblogs.com/

Bravesfan0224, Yes I do, It just made the most since. Although now it should be, “What is Bobby thinking, I can’t believe he’s benching Blanco in place of McLouth.”

Tomatalk, Its great.

Jurrjens, that just made me feel alot better, nice post Tomatalk.

Good luck Frenchy, I wish you nothing but the best. I hope you make this trade a regret for your sake. There are a ton of us that love ya man. Good luck

I’ll say this in regards to Frenchy: I hope you are a man amongst boys. And I mean BOYS. Sorry about our last encounter, but I’m sure I’ll forget all about it when you bash the Braves in front of the NY media. Remember, you’re under a magnifying glass.

bobbincox jr.. people are upset not because of the return but that Frenchy was one of the most beloved players on the team, to both the REAL fans and the players alike. He is a great guy who busted his *** at all times even if his numbers didn’t show it. He was a legendary high school athlete from Atlanta, he is McCann’s best friend, the guy that Chipper said was going to be the team leader for years to come, the guy who Smoltz took on golf outings with Tiger Woods. You people want to talk about “clubhouse chemistry,” how do you think it is now that one of the most well liked guys is now gone. It’s a shame he lost his swing because Frenchy was supposedly destined to be the second coming of Dale Murphy and the face of the franchise for the next 10 or so years. I’m really sad to see him go although he hasn’t produced in the past 2 years and hopefully he will come back in his new environment and prove everyone wrong.

Toma Talkin – you nailed the report card. Well done.

Tomatalk –

That just about sums it up. Pretty accurate in my opinion. The only thing missing is an overall grade. Using GPA average, I’m coming up with a 2.6 – which is a “C” (not factoring in +/-). I’d say that grade translates into a .500 team which is what we are. Well done. I’m always looking for a debate, and it sounds like you would appreciate some… but I am right there with you. This team is transparently a “C”.

Here’s the optimism in me. If we could make a move to bolster our offense to a c+ or b-, we have the pitching to get us far. That’s why I believe a move (more than Ryan Church) is essential. Not only for this season, but for the next two or three. If not, we would just waste the excellent pitching we have.

Also, a grade is missing – Front office, general manager. I think given the effort, and the acquisition of Vasquez, I am going with A – .

The second semester (second half) grade could be significantly lower if they don’t get us a bat.

Viva, Frenchy didn’t “lose” his swing. Pitchers just learned how to pitch to him and he’s never been able to adjust properly because he swings at everything. And the second you decide to run your baseball team based on sentiment rather than performance is the second your team goes down the drain. You bring up Dale Murphy….Dale Murphy was my childhood hero and a sports icon here in Atlanta, and despite that was still traded at the end of his career. And even being in severe decline, his OPS during his last stretch was nearly 100 points higher than Francoeur. If Murphy can get traded, anyone can get traded. And as far as clubhouse chemistry is concerned…I think I’ll side with Mark on this, when he said basically when the team wins, the chemistry is good, and vice versa. Francoeur wasn’t helping the chemistry with his poor performance. Particularly when it was obvious even to his own teammates that others were more deserving of starting time. And, I believe, deep down most fans want to see a winner take the field rather than a loveable, hometown hero with performance that doesn’t cut it on the major league level.

bobbycoxismyfather,
I disagree. Well, pitchers learned how to pitch to him after 1 month. And he wasn’t the super-human Pujols-type after that first month. But after that, in 2006-2007, pitchers knew how to pitch to him. He got by because he was athletic. When he did all that body-building crap pre-2008 season his athleticism was completely shot and he lacked any sort of foot or bat speed. Combined with his lack of baseball skill or ability (he was essentially a player who got by purely on athleticism pre-2008), he was a trainwreck in 2008 and 2009. If he can focus getting back into better baseball shape I think he has a shot at developing baseball skills (like, I don’t know, not swinging at breaking balls 2 feet off the plate and in the dirt) and becoming a decent player.

What PW said.

I don’t think he’s recovered from the pre-2008 workouts yet.

The body-building came into play during 2008. But not this year, where this past offseason he, publicly, relied on good baseball conditioning regimens and dropped a good amount of muscle and weight. You and I are saying similar things in different ways. You say he got by on pure athleticism, but lacks baseball skill/ability. I said he couldn’t have lost a swing that he never had (I could’ve also just said, like you, lack of baseball skill/ability). He’s never shown that he’s a true hitter with patience and discipline. That’s his real issue…plate discipline. And pitchers have just fed off of that. When he was hot during his inaugural season, every analyst said it wasn’t going to last because of his lack of patience and his unnerving desire to swing at every pitch.

bobbycoxismyfather – If he had had “plate discipline” in 2005, he never would have been the Frenchy that set the team and the city on fire. Plate discipline doesn’t make you a true hitter. It works for some and it doesn’t for others. Every hitter has a different approach. I liked to always take my first strike before I ever decided to swing… and it worked for me. However, I played with players who sat on the first pitch or first fastball and they raked.

Bravo, Every good hitter in the history of the game has had some degree of plate discipline in varying degrees…knowing the value of waiting on a certain pitch, understanding pitch counts and the likelihood of seeing certain pitches next, etc. Francoeur has none, and everyone knows it. He set the city on fire in 2005 because he was new and people hadn’t learned of his penchant to swing at everything regardless of how far off the plate it is. Where has his approach gotten him since? Just look at his OBP or OPS trends since 2005 and it paints a pretty vivid picture. With Francoeur’s mantra of going to the plate hacking, all it takes is a smart pitcher to throw him pitches off the plate and reel him in. Sure, Francoeur will use his athleticism to make contact at times, but when the pitcher just fed him something 2 feet off of the plate, you know that contact isn’t going to amount to much.

And if you’re Wren or Scheurholtz, how do you predict whether or not Francoeur will find it turn his god-given athleticism into something special on the field? You can’t predict that. All you can do is look at the YEARS worth of data and go from there. It’s not like they were dealing from a small sample size. Francoeur was given as much patience as any player in the game. Now, on a sentimental note, did you watch his interview in the locker room discussing the trade? It was gut wrenching and I felt for him, and wish him the best. But it was the right call.

Brian McCann and Chipper Jones for that matter are great examples of discipline at the plate. But, I think the main issue there especially with Frenchy is pitch recognition, and understanding what the pitchers are doing in order to get you out. If you can’t recognize the situation – that’s bad. If you can’t recognize the pitch coming at you – that’s worse. If you can’t recognize either, well, then – you get non tendered, or traded to the Mets.

PWHjort is WAY right with Ryan’s batting avg. being + .320 away from Citifield. Church has only played in the NL East having gone from Washington, his best seaon, to the Mets. He knows NL East pitching. I would comment more tomorrow but I’m going to Church baby~ Go Bravitos~

Alrighty, well I’m pretty sure I’m going to get screamed at for this but hey it seem’s at least a little possible:

Atl gets: Victor Martinez and Alexander Perez

Clev gets: Casey Kotchman, Kelly Johnson, and Kris Medlen

Maybe needs some work but hey could it be possible with the Indians wanting pitching and have deemed themselves sellers

I think the Bible Belt will be much more welcoming to Church than the Northeast

Thanks for the feedback on the report card, all. While there’s much debate in the Braves community about the deal, the Mets community is much more united in their disgust. If you get some time find some of the Mets blogs to see what they’re saying….it’s priceless.

When I talk about plate discipline, I mean swinging not swinging at pitches you can’t hit. Francoeur all too frequently swings at pitches he has no chance of even making contact with, much less actually doing anything with.

The first ”swinging” shouldn’t be there. [/slaps himself]

Wow tamtalk, you are right. They’re hateing Frechy, they don’t anything to do with him. I have a good feeling Ryan is gonna have about 15+ homeruns with us this season. (My opinion.) I do hope Frechy gets his swing back, and I hope Ryan is everything that people say. Has good Defence,Good bat, has a some power and can hit for avg. Lets hope he can help the Braves to a playoff run.

I like this trade. Frenchy is a great guy im sure but his performance wasnt helpin us one bit. I dont necessarily think this means were automatically goin to trade Church away. Well probably wait a couple weeks see how Ryan does and if he gets hot were done dealin if he doesnt do so well i could see another deal in the future. but we were lucky to get even a player of Ryan Church’s caliber cuz Frenchy’s stock had nearly hit rock bottom.
On another note, yes Im pretty sure Ryan’s song is crazy train. But chipper doesnt use that exact song nemore. He uses some remix of the song that only uses the very first part. I think Chip’s song is “Lets Go”. it’ll be interesting!!

The Braves Defensive Player of the game= Jair J.
The Braves Offensive Player of the game= Jair J.

jeff francoeur problem is simple, look at every other player that has come up with the braves. these young players get called up and within weeks there hitting goes down hill. you are seeing it with a recent trade that brought mclouth to the braves he came in hitting around 300. now he is dropping in batting average. terry pendleton is killing these young hitters. he took franceour a 300 plus hitter and turned him into a 240 hitter. he also killed andruw jones, who was also traded, jermaine dye, rafeal furcal, and the list goes on. its not hard to see the problem. the players have to put up with bobby cox, that should be enough, add pendleton to that, i would want to be traded too. dont see how chipper has made it as long as he has. must be a great player, in which i think he is. everybody that knows baseball will agree with me. go figure

jeff francoeur problem is simple, look at every other player that has come up with the braves. these young players get called up and within weeks there hitting goes down hill. you are seeing it with a recent trade that brought mclouth to the braves he came in hitting around 300. now he is dropping in batting average. terry pendleton is killing these young hitters. he took franceour a 300 plus hitter and turned him into a 240 hitter. he also killed andruw jones, who was also traded, jermaine dye, rafeal furcal, and the list goes on. its not hard to see the problem. the players have to put up with bobby cox, that should be enough, add pendleton to that, i would want to be traded too. dont see how chipper has made it as long as he has. must be a great player, in which i think he is. everybody that knows baseball will agree with me. go figure

Hey, if you want to bash TP go for it….you won’t be the first. Word of advice though, know what you’re talking about before trying to back up a point with “facts.” Let’s look at a few things you got wrong:
1) Jermaine Dye was traded 6 YEARS before Pendleton was a coach.
2) Rafael Furcal hit somewhere between .275 and .284 every year he was here while TP was a coach…..in terms of BA, his stats were very consistent.
3) McLouth was batting .256 before the trade to Atlanta. He’s batted .259 since the deal.
Maybe “[everyone] that knows baseball” would agree with you (though I doubt it), but it most certainly could not be for the reasons you just mentioned.

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